Curse

Sparrow_Lin · Aug 02, 2005, 03:58 AM // 03:58

if they are paying for the 'time' then they should be getting a slip of pape with the word 'time' on it and not get any gold, because they arn't paying for the gold apparantly.

Nash · Aug 02, 2005, 04:19 AM // 04:19

Judging by the items being sold, the text about them, and the fact that the items only exist in a game, I must conclude that anyone who buys and sells items on eBay is a retard.

Phades · Aug 02, 2005, 04:21 AM // 04:21

If paying for the time was acceptable, then all mmo's would be indirectly paying the playerbase instead of the playerbase paying their companies from all the artificial resource gathering that occurs. You could also factor in some kind of bonuses or incentives for people that actually help to improve gameplay.

Essentially, the whole "time" for "money" is a legal loophole. The people using this have no real time invested. The bottom line is that they are still making money off of another companies' intellectual property (you know the thing that the music/movie industry is fighting over right now). If anything the trade of such items devalues the income of the MMO game providers in the exact same way that piracy does, detracting from their direct income by allowing users to bypass various time sinks intended to keep them in the game to collect their monthly fees.

The entire sistuation is a byprodcut of the apathy society has created. This is very similar to the current stance of having the government protect our children instead of the parents. This is while at the same time not making legislature to support the parents of said children to ensure that they are being influenced in the proper way. What is happening instead is just ignoring the issue that the modern day family is more busy and splintered, looking for other ways to pass off the social learning needs away from the family and being forced upon the government.

Teh Azman · Aug 02, 2005, 04:26 AM // 04:26

Considering many of them are bots, no it's not time. And if you believe that you can really claim to be selling time and not look like a complete idiot...

...Then i guess I can believe that you will die alone.

Kishin · Aug 02, 2005, 04:41 AM // 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xellos

And you know, as funny as your trying to make their arguements look stupid, your using the exact same tactic.

So now it's "LOOK AT ME I R SMARTER THAN PPL WHO THINK THEY R SMARTER THAN THE LAW HAHA I PWNED THESE LEWZORZ"

You're right. But at the end of the day, it makes me feel better to say it, and to know I go to sleep not trading imaginary objects for not so imaginary monetary wealth.

I just drown kittens.

Somhairle Isis · Aug 02, 2005, 04:53 AM // 04:53

What if (stick with me here) those people selling that crap are actually ANet employees? I mean...who else has the ability to find rare @ss weapons? Perhaps they are ANet employees making up for the fact that GW isn't pay to play?

/conspiracy

Kaylynn Of Ascalon · Aug 02, 2005, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xellos

Because if you farm for like a week, or if you win HoH for a week, you can have more gold then you'll ever need? I mean, I've bought about ten or so 15k ascenscion armours, and I still got 600k gold just from 2 weeks of sigil hunting. What would I need gold for? Arrows?

so everyone should follow your plan so that they too will not care about gold?

I for one don't farm. It takes me forever to get any real amount of gold up to buy what I need. GOLD is worth something to me damnit. I have right now 23k and thats because I'm pulling all my funds together from 3 different chars and because I have made a few nice sells. besides that I get gold slowly. I don't want to waste my time farming. BORING. i want to play the game, the missions, the quests...by doing this you will not build up 100's of thousands of gold any time soon. 600K shit I can't imagine having that kind of gold. i see its easy for you to say gold is worthless. you have all of it!!! people that have tons of it don't care...its the people like me that struggle to get gold that care. so stfu.

Aracos79 · Aug 02, 2005, 05:13 AM // 05:13

Folks this is not about the reality of the situation. All that matters is legality. Are a lot of eBay sellers botters? Highly likely. Are they really selling their time? Of course not. Does the way they phrase things allow them to "get away with it"? Yep. And that's all that matters. We can call them all the names that we want, but the fact of the matter is they are in the clear to do what they do. ANet can try to ban their accounts, but that's it.

Makkert · Aug 02, 2005, 05:37 AM // 05:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xellos

Because if you farm for like a week, or if you win HoH for a week, you can have more gold then you'll ever need? I mean, I've bought about ten or so 15k ascenscion armours, and I still got 600k gold just from 2 weeks of sigil hunting. What would I need gold for? Arrows?

This one got me started.
Good one. Now THAT would be a moneysink for sure :P

Aracos79 · Aug 02, 2005, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makkert

This one got me started.
Good one. Now THAT would be a moneysink for sure :P

Oh there are plenty of things they could do in that direction if they really wanted a money sink. You could have melee weapons decay through use, forcing you to go to a "smith" character to have them repaired... which would cost money of course. You could do the same for armor as well. Casters could be forced to buy reagents and spell components. And of course the aforementioned arrows for archers. Glad ANet didn't go that direction though... that would be damn annoying. :P

Dax · Aug 02, 2005, 05:55 AM // 05:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaylynn Of Ascalon

so everyone should follow your plan so that they too will not care about gold?

I for one don't farm. It takes me forever to get any real amount of gold up to buy what I need. GOLD is worth something to me damnit. I have right now 23k and thats because I'm pulling all my funds together from 3 different chars and because I have made a few nice sells. besides that I get gold slowly. I don't want to waste my time farming. BORING. i want to play the game, the missions, the quests...by doing this you will not build up 100's of thousands of gold any time soon. 600K shit I can't imagine having that kind of gold. i see its easy for you to say gold is worthless. you have all of it!!! people that have tons of it don't care...its the people like me that struggle to get gold that care. so stfu.

While your comments are not directed at me...thank god (wink)

Just out of curiosity what's stopping you from doing missions and quests, farming? To play through PvE, you really don't need thatmuch gold.
Come to think of it you really don't need alot of things in this game.

Myth Osis · Aug 02, 2005, 08:11 AM // 08:11

Let me just say .... Time is not a Tradable commodity.

That is to pay some one for thier time. You are not "Paying for thier time" as such but are paying for their services.

That is ......

You dont pay a builder the time it takes to build a house. You pay him for his labour to build a house, this may be gaugued by time, but is not the time itself.

So you are not paying for their time, however you are paying for thier services. As you are paying for thier services they are in business and they should be paying tax. This is why most sweetshops are ilegal, as they dont pay tax. Well that and they probably pay less than the min wage.

As for the one off ebays.
Good luck A-Net.

Spark · Aug 02, 2005, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Quote:

Let me just say .... Time is not a Tradable commodity.

That is to pay some one for thier time. You are not "Paying for thier time" as such but are paying for their services.

That is ......

You dont pay a builder the time it takes to build a house. You pay him for his labour to build a house, this may be gaugued by time, but is not the time itself.

So then, I don't pay the builder for the house, right? I pay him for putting in nails, setting the foundation, etc. In the GW situation, gold is the house. Farming is the construction. What they are selling is a service to gather gold. They are not selling the gold itself, but rather the process and effort it takes to gather the gold.

Phades · Aug 02, 2005, 08:49 AM // 08:49

Computer code doesnt build anything on its own, or are you suggesting we give real money to a non-entity, since that is the time and service that is being used. Applying that logic to the real world roughly equates out to slavery and theft. You can apply the metephor however you desire.

coolsti · Aug 02, 2005, 09:48 AM // 09:48

I guess there are many different ways to get enjoyments out of games like this, but I for one cannot see the point of obtaining any kind of skill or item if I didn't "earn" it within the game. Its such a joy to finally find something or finally get up to a higher level. What's the point of buying it instead?

I actually dread the day that my character has maxed out to level 20 and has excellant armor and weapons. Because that's the day I probably will start all over again with a new character or stop playing.

But perhaps its just me. I play at my own pace, I avoid gifts from other players (like from guild members), I don't intend to be run to a location I can't get to with a group similar to my level, and so far I haven't looked to purchase anything from any non-AI players (that includes bots ;-)

ShinJin Kahn · Aug 02, 2005, 10:03 AM // 10:03

You know, it's easy to say money is worthless when you have 600k in stoarge, and about 500 gold everythings, it's no so easy to say when your struggling through the game not able to buy new armour or a better weapon then the one you found on the floor in old ascalon.

ALOT of the rich people just dont see what the poor are trying to say, which just shows ignorance.

I've had the chance to see both sides in a very short time span, so i have a good understanding of what it's like to not even be able to afford that basics (id kit, armour) to having more money then you know what to do with (3 sets of 15k armour, sup vig and absorp on each, 3 totally maxed out gold weapons 15>50,10/10 5/1).

When you know good farming spots, and know how to buy and sell it's easy, but thats how it is with all things in life, when you know, it's simple, when you dont, it's dreadfull, the rich people need to try and understand that.

Obsiedion · Aug 02, 2005, 01:05 PM // 13:05

The bottom line is this, People want to waste their Real hard earned cash because they are too lazy to earn it in game, let um. The risks are ofcourse obvious. Its a breach of ANets code, and probably most peoples moral ethics, but Jeez.

REAL CASH FOR FAKE CASH? see in the real world it would be a legal mine field. But hey its not the real world, and dont forget supply and demand. Nutshell analysis...

Stupid people + too much cash = greedy people with lots of cash.

Santanus_Perro · Aug 02, 2005, 01:30 PM // 13:30

The only way to get rid of "cash for gold" on eBay is to police players who get a huge influx of cash and investigate it. If no one is buying, these "cash for gold" auctions will go away.

Aniewiel · Aug 02, 2005, 01:35 PM // 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Santanus_Perro

The only way to get rid of "cash for gold" on eBay is to police players who get a huge influx of cash and investigate it. If no one is buying, these "cash for gold" auctions will go away.

Wouldn't work. What if your guildmate gives you 100k? I have given tons of gold away to guildies.

The only way to do it would be to look for transactions between known gold-seller accounts and users.

noblepaladin · Aug 02, 2005, 01:58 PM // 13:58

It is legal to buy the gold because you are buying their time, in the sense that you won't go to jail for it and nobody will be able to successfully sue over it.

It is also legal for A.Net to delete your account if they feel like it and not give you an explaination at all, as agreed on the EULA. You can't do anything about it.

Everything can be simplifed further: If A.Net finds out you brought gold, they will delete your account. The choice of what to do is up to you.